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Thank you.
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Welcome to the Standard Bank CIB Why She Leads podcast.
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My name is Judy Lamini and I will be your host.
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In this series, we're looking at the powerhouse dealmakers who happen to be
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women.
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It's women who can stand their own anywhere in the world, but they choose to
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be at Standard Bank CIB.
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They are inspired to inspire.
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My guest that I'm looking forward to chatting to is Tandiwe
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Lihwaile. She is the head of Transaction Banking, South Africa.
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Morning, Tandiwe.
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Very good morning, Doctor.
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How are you?
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I'm well, thank you.
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It's an honour to have you.
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Yeah, privileged to be here.
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Yeah.
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You had six years as a practising attorney, and then you came here and never
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left.
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Yes.
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What would you do differently, knowing what you know now,
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when you were planning your career and what to study?
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There's very little I would change actually, Judy.
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I was very deliberate about my career from a young girl in
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the village.
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I was very clear that I wanted to work for the biggest companies in the world.
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I wanted to be a lawyer.
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I equally wanted to study in the best universities of the country and I set out
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to do
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that.
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And when I graduated as a lawyer and I started practicing,
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I got exposure into corporate and I got exposure into banking but then it was
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about commercial
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litigation, it was about the drafting of contract.
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We were working for some of the banks in South Africa.
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And I was head-hunted from there actually because I was writing opinions about some
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of the
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banking laws that were changing at the time and therefore
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I feel like the legal background has actually taught me how to think,
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how to process problems, how to solve problems which I think I'm damn good at
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it.
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That's actually interesting because we always think of our careers based on
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the first professional training.
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Yes.
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And we forget that it's just a thing, it teaches you how to think.
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Teaches you how to think.
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I must say that when we are actually in the process of structuring a deal,
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I do put my legal hat at times and there will be lawyers in the room
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and I would challenge the lawyers because then I would be actually putting on my
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legal hat.
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But I would say largely, The law degree and actually the six years in practice
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helped me to solve problems
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because in the legal field you are given a multitude of challenges that our clients
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brought to us and therefore we
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had to apply the law to the facts and to the issue and then recommend a solution to
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the client.
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I'm very proud and I think of what I've learned and produced at the time but
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obviously got introduced
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into the bank and have never looked back since then and I'm loving it here.
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And it's been what?
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16, 19 years?
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It's going 18 years.
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Wow.
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Yes.
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That's a long time.
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What keeps you coming back to the same institution?
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Yeah.
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What's the pull?
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I'd say it's the culture.
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Okay.
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It's the culture, the Standard Bank culture, you can almost touch and feel it.
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Here it feels like home.
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It feels like home because throughout my career,
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I was allowed to make mistakes as I explored various solutions to the
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challenges of the bank.
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When you make those mistakes, you take accountability, you learn from them,
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you actually tend to make a much bigger impact on the bank when you then try to
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solve
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the problem.
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Because we're not scared, you have the protection.
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And when we win the deals, we celebrate and we celebrate big.
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We celebrate big.
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In my business, we have champagne months.
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When we hit our revenue targets or project targets, we have champagne to celebrate it
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because we would have worked hard.
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And it remunerates, actually, Standard Bank rewards the performance.
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And when you're in a place where we're not appreciated, we're not rewarded well,
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you're likely to look somewhere else.
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And Standard Bank has not given me any reason to look anywhere else.
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Yeah.
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And growth opportunities as well.
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have been immense.
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I've had an opportunity to work in the rest of Africa, in West Africa region,
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exposed to other cultures,
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so it's been beautiful.
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In the morning I look forward to to come into this place.
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I kick the blankets because I'm looking to make some form of a difference.
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Yeah, it's amazing what you say because it matters a lot for everyone.
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You're involved in the origination of the deal, the structuring, you're involved
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with mergers and acquisitions,
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corporate advisory.
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What actually talks to you?
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Like which aspect of that?
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I think the day-to-day clients, transitional banking for me is very
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important.
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We bank the biggest companies in the continent, actually, in this bank.
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Those that employ a lot of people.
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And therefore just processing a salary on a salary day is very big.
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Because a security company needs the security guys to be paid so that at the
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gate of your estate,
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there's a security who shows up to provide the security.
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So as in many companies, we pay salaries of teachers and therefore processing a
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payment,
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a simple thing as a payment, brings a lot of stability into our clients' companies.
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And just processing an ordinary payment, when I see one of our big retailers'
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trucks on the road,
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I know that I'm moving that truck because I've made a payment.
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So the simplicity of banking for me moves me.
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It's interesting you bring small companies too like mine, you pay the salaries for my
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staff.
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Exactly.
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And it's important to receive that din-ding on the 20th.
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It's important, you can't miss it and therefore we have to make sure that the
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stability is there in
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terms of our systems and processes
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so that we can deliver a seamless client experience for our clients as well as on
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your employees.
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Yeah.
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Now tell me, You have mentors, I assume?
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Yes, I do.
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What's the one thing that you are happy they told you that you use in your daily
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life?
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Two things actually I would reference.
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One is I should forgive myself whenever
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I've made a mistake and that there will be setbacks and that I should not dwell on
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those
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setbacks.
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And what's important is the comeback.
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and that I should come back and do my utmost best to come out of it.
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Because at times we tend to punish ourselves when we've gotten something
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wrong.
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And therefore, I've learned to be kind with myself.
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Having grown from the villages again, worked hard to come out from where I was,
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and success drives me.
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Back then, when I didn't succeed, I would punish myself.
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And I would spend...
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days weeks actually reflecting on what had gone wrong but now i'm very kind to myself
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i
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learned from the setbacks and i move on yeah that's amazing yeah and i can relate
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to that i
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think women tend to be very unkind to themselves but kind to everyone else true
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you've
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been mentored and you also mentor others correct and what have you learned from
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your
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mentees if anything I learn a lot actually.
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I'm very deliberate with my engagement sessions with my mentees.
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They have to be regular, they have to be planned so that we keep at it.
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And whenever I walk away from that conversation, I feel energized.
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I take an opportunity to reflect on my own journey.
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And to the extent that there is an alignment to, or in a way,
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similarities on the challenges that the mentee is having to what I have.
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gone through,
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I take the time to share my own lessons and I play more of a role of encouraging
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the mentee to try more.
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And when I walk away from that conversation and if I am experiencing a
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challenge at the time, I take my own advice.
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I take my own advice and apply it.
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Well, I have a letter from one of those mentees.
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This one is from Shamiso Mapanga.
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Dear Tandiwe, Tandiwe, you've been a guiding force in my life,
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showing me how to balance a successful career with personal fulfillment,
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all the while breaking barriers and challenging norms.
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Your belief in me has opened doors,
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pushing me to excel and leading with purpose, integrity and heart.
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Tandiwe, you've not only taught me the importance of prioritizing both my mental
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and
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physical health.
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But you've also shown through your own example how living a balanced life
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positively influences both work and family.
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You lead by example,
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achieving remarkable success in your career while nurturing a family and
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well-being.
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Beyond your advocacy for women, you lead with boldness and inspiration,
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rewarding success, unifying teams, and driving business growth.
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You have inspired me and countless others.
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in unimaginable ways.
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I'm deeply grateful for your unwavering support and dedication to empowering women
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to reach their full potential.
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Thank you, Shamis.
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Oh my goodness.
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Oh, that's so beautiful.
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Really humbling.
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You never know how you're touching people's lives in those engagements.
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You think that it's a conversation.
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You don't know how people take their advice and apply it in their personal life
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and work.
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To hear such a beautiful letter for me, it is fulfilling as well.
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Because one thing I'm trying to do is to leave a legacy behind.
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Because I've been helped by others before and
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I take the time to help others.
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to inspire others, to guide, to mentor.
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Because without that, sometimes we don't know whether what we're doing right, you
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know,
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and whether we're headed the right direction.
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And getting the feedback, it's such a beautiful gift.
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It makes it worth it.
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It makes it worth it.
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It makes it worth it.
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You know, when I lead, I feel so fulfilled.
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And when I'm able to shift a situation that is dire
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and I produce a positive outcome, I feel so fulfilled.
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When I win, I feel so fulfilled.
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And I think that all comes from that girl child that wanted to escape the villages.
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And it fulfills me to this day.
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And when I go back home,
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I try and spend time with the kids in the village in my school where I went.
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Because I want them too to believe that they can escape the poor, the poverty
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life,
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the dusty roads and villages of the Eastern Cape and become lawyers and head
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of businesses.
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That's my purpose.
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Yeah, that's amazing.
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It's a purpose worth living for.
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Yeah.
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I want to lead here.
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and I want to live in my home and I live in my village where I come from.
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That's amazing.
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You know we still have issues when it comes to gender equity, gender equality.
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Men still lead in all sectors of our lives basically.
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What do you think both men and women leaders can do more to change
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the status quo because SDG 5 and 10 matter for all countries.
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How do we work closer to it as leaders across gender?
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I think programs such as these, Why She Leads, are very instrumental.
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We've got to work on women to believe that they can.
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They can lead, they can run businesses of the significance of business I lead today.
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Because we tend to doubt ourselves because of our upbringing or maybe the challenges
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that we...
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encountering.
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So being intentional about the women development, it's important.
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I didn't get here on my own.
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I got support, even though at the time there were no formal programs.
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But having somebody who recognizes my potential and say if this lady is given
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the opportunity
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and is supported, she can have a significant impact on the business.
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So we've got to be intentional about that.
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The more of women that believe that they can, we can overcome that.
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And then I suppose from the men's side,
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creating the space for women to lead and being
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comfortable that women can lead,
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being comfortable to give a woman a meaningful mandate.
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When I took over this business, we had a program we called Women Agenda.
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We wanted to ensure that we invest in the learning and development of women.
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So our budget was going towards women in terms of learning and development.
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Senior sponsorship programs towards women.
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Recruitment was very deliberate around women because
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I didn't have women largely at my table, so it's a level below.
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And therefore when you work with people in culture, the HR, I think somewhere else
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it's called,
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When you work with your resourcing team and you say, I actually want to attract
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women, I want to help them learn,
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you actually start to shape the leadership teams.
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You actually start to shape the workforce,
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and therefore it is being deliberate about the programs.
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Because naturally it's just not going to happen.
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No, definitely.
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Yeah.
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Definitely.
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No, that's profound.
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19 years of marriage.
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two kids later yes climbing the corporate ladder yeah what would you tell your
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16 year old self in the village knowing what you know now well you've done well
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girl
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i would say that um there's been tough times um
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is i was um starting a family
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With my husband, we had our son on our first year of marriage, it was easy.
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Two pregnancies thereafter, I lost.
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I'm sorry about that.
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So there's a seven-year gap between my daughter and my son.
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Somehow, I think God designed it in a way that I'm able to manage it.
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And in that seven years, one does invest in the career growth.
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It was not easy, I must say, because I lost the two.
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kids at 28 weeks, both of them.
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So I was quite advanced and therefore that was hard.
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That was hard because I felt like I was failing as a woman.
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I was failing to have a child and in a way kind of also blamed how hard I was working
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at the time
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because when you get married and you're likely in your middle management level and
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you're starting to grow your
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career but at the same time you want to have children.
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So I blamed myself a lot about the loss of those kids.
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But I've learned to forgive myself.
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I've learned to forgive myself and I had a very supportive husband
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who assured me every time that I was enough.
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And I made it here.
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And now that I have two children of my own, in December...
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I've got seven children at any given point in time because I take my sister's kids
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and my brother's kids and my nieces
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and therefore they spend time in my house.
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I am still fulfilled.
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I wanted to have four children.
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I've got two children of my own but I've got enough space and life for all other
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kids in the family.
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So I've done very well.
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That's amazing.
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You have done amazingly well and you know you say something that's very important
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that
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I think we always have to say to young women especially how it matters to have a
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supportive
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partner.
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Yes.
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So choosing the right partner for you matters, would you agree?
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I've had an opportunity to have conversation with women that are
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struggling to fall pregnant and women
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that have had numerous miscarriages.
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And when I would encounter those women, I would ask myself, God, is this the lesson
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I was supposed to impart or a lesson for me too, so that I can have conversations
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with these women.
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But nevertheless, it was hard.
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And I think to that 16-year-old girl, I would say when these things happen,
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you must take it easy on yourself.
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You really, really have done well.
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I've enjoyed the journey.
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Yeah, and you've inspired so many.
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by just being you, you know, and living your life, you know.
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I try to bring myself to work.
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Yeah, that shows.
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I bring myself.
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If I was to pretend to be somebody else, I would not be where I am today.
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I'm a hugger.
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I hug a lot.
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I love fun.
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And therefore, if you are to go to my office now, I've got a cupboard with
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whiskeys and champagne.
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Because we work hard.
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I do have tea.
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I do have all kinds of tea.
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I do have tea because we work hard.
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We spent eight...
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10 hours of our lives here at Standard Bank and therefore a moment of celebration
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with the
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team.
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High five and then pause and say look how far we've come and let's show up tomorrow
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again and do it again.
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That is why you can win year after year and year and year and
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I suppose the environment also becomes easy for people because they want to work
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for you.
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They will not come here and have fun.
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they want to deliver for the business you make work home home wow that's profound oh
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it was
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such an honor to meet you and may the future be even brighter than now god
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willing thank you
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very much for the conversation i thoroughly enjoyed it thank you i enjoyed
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it too it was an honor to meet you thank you
